Eklektikos: A Contemporary Christian Blog

Eklektikos is dedicated to providing informative, uplifting and inspirational news, articles and commentary to our readers, in our ongoing effort to share the love of Christ with others in this fallen world. To God be the glory! This is the blog version of our main webzine 'Eklektikos: A Contemporary Christian Digest.' Like our main webzine, this blog is updated weekly, unless circumstances require otherwise.

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I am the executive editor of the webzine "Eklektikos: A Contemporary Christian Digest", a tireless researcher seeking a deeper and clearer knowledge regarding the past, present and future plight of Christians in our fallen world.

Wednesday, February 23, 2005

Praying Down the Apocalypse

I guess I'm a little naive when it comes to some things. I heard a fellow Christian say a while back that they hoped the LORD would hurry up and come and that they weren't all that concerned with certain current events (we were talking about a one world currency) because it just meant that we were nearing the end, we would be raptured, Christ would set up his millennial reign and everything would be just great. I thought they were just an anomaly. I mean, my mouth dropped when they said that, but I didn't give it much thought because I just thought they were not the norm.

All that ended today when I was surfing the net and landed on these two articles... I provide the links at the end of the quote, but the quotes give you a general idea of how "they" view "us":

"They are sincere, serious and polite as they tell you that they feel called to help bring the Rapture on as fulfillment of biblical prophecy. That’s why they have declared solidarity with Israel and the Jewish settlements and backed up their support with money and volunteers. It’s why they have staged confrontations at the old temple site in Jerusalem. It’s why the invasion of Iraq for them was a warm-up act...." This is from an article written by Bill Moyers and posted on: http://www.sentienttimes.com/04/oct_nov_04/journalism.html, (italics are mine.)

"The Rapture is a good thing, and therefore floods, famine, drought and all that are also good things because they portend the coming of end times. Even liberalism is a good thing, because there need to be a lot of Christ- deniers for the end times to come. (Among the prophesied Christ-deniers: the pope. That part is pretty much played down in the pamphlets.)" This is from an article written by John Carroll of the San Francisco Chronicle and can be found here: http://www.rense.com/general63/rap.htm Also from this same article: "The rest of the ungodly losers are left to deal with natural disasters and wars and the armies of the Antichrist, after which they die in various colorful ways while the ranks of the saved watch with compassion tempered with an understandable sense of satisfaction."

These comments were in response, in part, to a website called Rapture Ready. It gauges certain events that they feel like are mentioned in apocalyptic writings to help the reader determine how close we might be to the rapture. Given that Moyers says in his article certain Christians feel the need "to help bring the Rapture on as fulfillment of biblical prophecy ", I guess my Christian friend wasn't such an anomaly after all.

I suppose my naiveté' lay in the fact that certain people would actually pray for this to happen quickly....I mean, have they actually read what is going to happen? The fourth seal unleashes the power for one fourth of the world to die from plagues, battle, hunger and “death” (Rev. 6:8). The sixth trumpet releases “four angels who had been prepared for the hour and day and month and year”, to kill a third of mankind (Rev. 9:15). This doesn’t even include all the natural disaster that will befall the earth, like the destruction of the vegetation, the seas, the plague of locusts, the darkening of the heavenly bodies, plus much more. This isn’t the movies people! This is the wrath of an Almighty GOD!! REAL people will die REAL awful, agonizing, horrible deaths. Didn’t Jesus pray on the cross, “Father, forgive them, for they know not what they do.” And here SOME of us are, actually praying just the opposite!!!No wonder the unsaved (like those quoted above) have such disgust for a lot of Christians! Could it be they see this self-righteous, hubristic attitude for what it is? After all, “they” won’t be here for any of it! They’ll be raptured!!! What if their interpretation of the Scriptures is not correct? What if the rapture ISN’T pre-trib? There are many, many people out there who think we will be around for some of the awful things prophesied in Revelations. It says in Revelations that some will be martyred for the faith, and they will cry out “How long, O Lord, holy and true, until You judge and avenge our blood on those who dwell on the earth?” Could it be possible that true Christians will be martyred because the so-called “church” has exhibited such arrogance and self-righteousness that the rest of the world thinks that is what everyone who calls himself a Christian is really like? Are they bringing about our very own persecution by their prayers?
Furthermore, why would we want to hurry up the return of CHRIST…after all, once the judgment of the earth starts, that’s IT for your unsaved friends! Their chance is over.
Finally, why do these people think they need to help GOD out? I mean, really…what are they thinking? They will manipulate politics, etc. to FORCE things to look like their interpretation of Revelations, to FORCE GOD’S HAND? I don’t think so!!!

8 Comments:

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Dear Kitty,
I am so sick and tired of dealing with that Pre-Trib Rapture crowd. Once they find out that you are not Pre-Trib, many of them actually hate you and refuse to have anything else to do with you. There are, right now, as I write this a few pre-tribbers out there who actually hate me. I've made many of them mad, but that's just too bad, I really didn't mean to. I heard Texe Marrs say that this subject alone was causing Christians to hate each other(and in my opinion, they wouldn't mind killing one another). That's sad, because it's not Christian to hate. To me, a lot of times certain kinds of thinking about certain subjects can become idolatrous and that isn't any good! I believe that most of people's thinking concerning the rapture comes from t.v. preachers anyway. Most churches will hardly touch the subject and if they do, they just echo the t.v. preachers. But really honestly and seriously, I believe a Pre-Trib Rapture mentality pacifies folks who don't want to study the scriptures on the subject for themselves. It's easier to echo Hal Lindsey. God, the Holy Spirit, guides His people into all truth; but you have to want to know the truth. I am still learning on the subject. Right now I am being led to read some of the 'forgotten' and 'hidden' books of the Bible. I am hungry to seek and to know the truth myself. I believe it's time to move on and leave the Pre-trib Rapture bunch behind![Gosh, did I say Leave behind??] Luv, Boudini

Friday, February 25, 2005 1:45:00 AM  
Blogger Kitty said...

I agree with you. It seems to me like a lot of them adhere to it almost like it is a religion, and I don't Tim LaHaye helped out with this at all. They are entitled to their "take" on things, although I don't agree with it. But, I can't understand getting so worked up over not agreeing with them to hate them or even be angry at them about it! That is kind of weird to me. As to the churches not touching that subject, there are a lot of subjects churches won't touch, and I think that is sad and shows the downfall of churchianity in America. In my opinion, some of them don't want to even consider an althernative because of its implications. I think it engenders an enormous amount of fear in them to think they will have to go through some of that stuff. I know it scares the heck out of me! But then again, we see some of prophecy being fulfilled, but we don't really KNOW how close we are to this coming about. It could take another couple of hundred years or more for some of that stuff to happen. In my opinion, it is just a statement of the American churches' arrogance to think we will just blissfully be whisked away right before all the bad stuff starts to happen and nothing will happen to us....there are people in the world right now that are being murdered for their belief in Christ...now that is a TRUE Christian to me, and I am in awe of that strength....why do we think (as an aggregate) that if it is happening to them, it won't happen to us? Just because we're Americans? That is a smugness I'm not comfortable with.

Just my opinion, for what it's worth.

Friday, February 25, 2005 11:16:00 AM  
Blogger Jot said...

It seems that a lot of people make a lot out of 'when' the rapture is going to take place. To me, that, in itself, is odd. Jesus made it clear that no one is going to know! In Matthew 24:36, He says, "But of that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of heaven, but My Father only." If it's not important for Jesus to know 'when', then I must say it's not important for us to know 'when' either! Jesus goes on to say in v42-44, "Watch therefore, for you do not know what hour your Lord is coming. But know this, that if the master of the house had known what hour the thief would come, he would have watched and not allowed his house to be broken into. Therefore you also be ready, for the Son of Man is coming at an hour you do not expect." For this reason, I don't worry about 'when' the rapture is going to occur, but instead focus on trying to live each day (each hour, each minute) for Christ. He'll take care of the rest!
Kitty writes, "I suppose my naiveté' lay in the fact that certain people would actually pray for this to happen quickly..." To me, for people to pray such a thing risks coming close to praying against the very PLAN of God! In 2 Peter 3:9, we're taught, "The Lord is not slack concerning His promise, as some count slackness, but is longsuffering toward us, not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance." In light of this Scripture, should anyone be praying for the rapture while so much of the world is ignorant of the Gospel? Should we not, instead, double our efforts to spread the Good News rather than take (what appears to me to be) an attitude of 'I've got mine, too bad for you!'? That's just wrong! Kitty, you're right when you point out, "…after all, once the judgment of the earth starts, that’s IT for your unsaved friends! Their chance is over." If we love our neighbors as ourselves, we should be praying for their salvation - willing to lay down our own lives for theirs, as Christ laid down His life for us - rather than taking a 'rescue me quick, before the ugly stuff starts' attitude!
Kitty writes, "Could it be possible that true Christians will be martyred because the so-called 'church' has exhibited such arrogance and self-righteousness that the rest of the world thinks that is what everyone who calls himself a Christian is really like? Are they bringing about our very own persecution by their prayers?" I think the answer to this question is, quite simply, yes. In Revelation 2:10, Jesus, speaking to the persecuted church at Smyrna, says, "Do not fear any of those things which you are about to suffer. Indeed, the devil is about to throw some of you into prison, that you may be tested, and you will have tribulation ten days. Be faithful until death, and I will give you the crown of life." Clearly, and as Jesus stated in John 16:33, believers will certainly suffer tribulation - whether or not it's the 'Great Tribulation' I can't say. But is that truly a point on which we should dwell? I contend it's a ploy used by Satan to distract us from our true calling! We aren't to worry about 'when' we'll be raptured! We're to do the will of our Father who created us - He'll take care of the rest!

As an aside - I haven't been able to find the word 'rapture' in my concordance. Can you direct me to the Scripture that tells us for certain such a thing is going to happen? I mean, in Revelation 3:10, Jesus, speaking to the faithful church in Philadelphia, says, "Because you have kept My command to persevere, I also will keep you from the hour of trial which shall come upon the whole world, to test those who dwell on the earth." Let's look at this for a second, as I know many who point to the Scripture as one proving the rapture. Christ speaks of keeping His command to persevere - persevere through what? Does this not indicate a steadfast faith through some sort of trial(s) or tribulation(s)? Christ then says He will keep those who have persevered from the 'hour of trial which shall come upon the whole world, to test those who dwell on the earth' - the hour of trial (to me) indicates a specific event, not a seven-year tribulation period, or even a 3 1/2 year period of 'great tribulation'. Further, Christ says this hour of trial will come upon the 'whole world' - which is where we live, right? - 'to test those who dwell on the earth.' Is it possible, since rapture isn't mentioned a single time in the Bible, this passage simply means Christ will provide protection during the 'hour of trial'? Is it possible this is what He means?
Of course, the primary passage pointed to by people when discussing the rapture is found in 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17, which says, "For the Lord himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord." Verse 18 teaches that we should "comfort one another with these words." This speaks of taking comfort in the assurance that Christ is returning - it doesn't at all speak to 'when'.
Finally (since I've almost written a book here - sorry!), I must agree with your assertion that those followers of Churchianity could very easily be embracing the doctine of pre-trib rapture because it offers them an 'out' - thereby relieving them of any worry they might otherwise have with regard to the coming tribulation period. Make no mistake, the tribulation period is surely coming! When? No one knows for certain, as all Christ gave us in Matthew 24 were signs to watch for. I'm seeing some of these signs today, but have seen many such signs for many years. (People 100 years ago believed Christ's return was eminent then, too!) As I said in the beginning of this now-too-large volume of a response - If it's not important for Jesus to know 'when', then I must say it's not important for us to know 'when' either! Just focus on trying to live each day for Christ and He'll take care of the details! To God always be the Glory!

not1jot

Friday, February 25, 2005 5:43:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Dear Jot,
I agree with most of what you are saying,Jot, please don't get me wrong... but for years, ever since I was saved, I have been obsessed(For lack of a better word) with the signs of the times. I know that people 100 yrs ago thought the return of Christ was eminent and even the disciples thought the time was close. Nevertheless, with each passing day it is closer obviously, but to me it is a subject that stays on my mind and in my spirit and when I witness to people the subject somehow most of the time comes up. I've even had dreams pertaining to it. When we do the work of Jesus, it is while it is still day, because a day will come when no man or person can work. We have led people to the Lord by talking about the signs that they could see, thereby the Holy Spirit showed them the reality of Christ and the need to be saved. I know for sure that we are called as end-time ministers(and you and Kitty too!) because God has shown us so much. Just today I heard that a man lost his job of 12 years from Quick Trip because he refused to have a thumb print in order to work. The possibility of having humans and animals cloned is so real these days. Not only that, but, people are being persecuted because they refuse things like retina scans,and other procedures that violate their personal rights. Never in the history of man have humans ever been this close to having a computer chip ready to be inserted in their right hands or foreheads for identification/and other purposes. I know that God has set apart His children and will keep His own in the days to come with mighty signs and powerful miracles. And yes, many will suffer, but only to the glory of God. ...May His Name be Praised Forever! ~B.J.

Friday, February 25, 2005 9:26:00 PM  
Blogger hummer said...

All I know is, and I say this with complete confidence, we are one day closer to the second coming of Christ today than we were yesterday.
Read 2 Peter ch 3 Living in the hope of the Lord's coming.

Saturday, March 12, 2005 11:56:00 PM  
Blogger Mythological Stranger said...

I saw a report on the history channel a while back (a couple of months at least, so the name and date escape me) that was dealing with people predicting the end. Basically, from the time Jesus ascended, people have "predicted" his return over and over again. As not1jot says, it cannot be predicted. My personal interpretation, take it with a grain of salt, is that christians will not be raptured until after much of the tribulation. It certainly wouldn't be much of a tribulation if there weren't any christians around whose faith could be tested by it, now would it?

just my opinion. I guess we'll all find out in the magical time I call "eventually"

Saturday, March 19, 2005 4:47:00 AM  
Blogger Alvin Miller said...

My inaugural address at the Great White Throne Judgment of the Dead.

At: http://www.angelfire.com/crazy/spaceman

Sunday, December 18, 2005 6:08:00 AM  
Anonymous health quotes said...

I am still learning on the subject. Right now I am being led to read some of the 'forgotten' and 'hidden' books of the Bible.The possibility of having humans and animals cloned is so real these days. Not only that, but, people are being persecuted because they refuse things like retina scans,and other procedures that violate their personal rights.

Friday, November 19, 2010 4:13:00 AM  

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